- ' _ - • •· -t· • - DEPARTMENT OF STATE ·DPC· 24·2 TRANSCR PT OF_DAILY NEWS· BRH FING· ·· T_UESDAY DECli' R 2 8 19 t 12 _ 4p P M ON THE RECORD UNLESS OTHERWISE NOTED - • i- - 1 r 4• • _ - · MR -TRA TTNER than the•A fo-llowincf · ·which· r· would- record · ·- d it will be like' to ·read into 1 the ·'a is'tributed 'tb you by someone as· I ···am do i ng' it_- ' ·' _ ···' _ - ·- - - ' - - - r - -- doh·atin·g to· the· Unl te·a States of Ame'l ica ··for pre·servation a·t· -the tibrary ··of ·cong res's ·t11e' transdrib d notes of telephone-' cdn' 'rersatiori-s dut-incj° liis · ·• ·tJecr tarial y aitf· in· •• ' governmeht ' 'The' notes ·were made as 1l- ine1nory· aid and to 1 insure apprbpriate· adntinistratl e- f l1-low· fup· - but were not in themselves ac tion dodumerit They ·were never circulated and ·an y action · res -ul ting from the conversations would be contained in the admiri tstrati ve folinc a-up · · · ''Nevertheles·s to ·avoid any misinterpretation during his ·final days 1n' publio office ·the has decided to secretary give···the notes at this time to the Library of congress as pa t of t he gift to the riation of his - A-2 personal _and public papers which was announced last week The notes are being donated under a separate deed of gift because of the significant rights of privacy that may exist for persons who were parties to the telephone 1 conversations - his separate deed of gift incorporates the terms of the original donation At the end of the time period specified in the original donation any paper in this group will be available for public access The sole difference is that if one of the parties to the conversation is still living his consent must first be secured A copy of the dee d of gift is attached 11 And I believe y ou also have that in what we have distributed to you now That is the end o f the announcement Q Where is the Washington Post Q Is there a list of the people with whom these conversations were h e ld A Ken I do not know I would have to take theques tion and look into it Q Was the decision made because of the state- ment made by the archivist A Was the decision to donate t hese rpapei s - - -- - - DECLASSIFIED JAuthority NN D19 A-3 these telephone notes made Q Yes A Bernie I do not think that i s the right interpretation I think t he answe r is that i t was recog- nized that the re were certain righ t s of pri vacy raised by the notes which were not raised by the other pape rs Wh at was clear was that t he notes on the t elephone conversations were not going to t he Library o f Congress under t h e initial donation and that no decision had b een reached at that time Now the Se cre t ary has h ad time to focus on the special privacy issue and has reached his decis ion Q Now that t he Secretary has had time to what A Has had time to f ocus on the special privacy issue and has r eached his de cis ion Q I am confused Q Wh at did the archivist s ay A That was -- i t was contained in a -- one of y our colleagues cited I think a bulletin from the GSA a GSA bul l e tin wri tten by or compiled by the National Archivist to the effect that there could be -- and I am only talking from memory don't quote me exactly r j I can DECLASSIFIED Authority J LD19S 5i - - - - - - - - - - • -____ _ __ii - - - -- - ---- --- - -- -__ ___ - u get it for you aj er that there could be no separation between personal and private papers Q No that is not what no · rt was that any conversations any papers dealing with official business whether marked personal or not had to be included in official_ p pers • -Q Q Why not look -it up But the question here i s also will tjle copies of the phone conversations be in the officia J_- record _ at the State Department or will they only be found in the papers that will be g-i ven to-_ e -Library of Congress A It is_ my undex standi-ng _tll at-- these are· o iginals that are being given and that there are no copies -It is -my understanding • Q But these won't be available except under the 25-year rubrlc or the five years after his death A Ken go back to the annoJ mqement - - I think the answer to your questions is coverf d there Q In other words- the Secretary will not be making any use of these papers hi mself in this period A Hen ry I think probably I w0u J _d have to loo t into that one for you as well 1-• -- - A-5 ·o A Will you Yes · r- Q Q He is using them all Q o· of 'The'sentence·h re at··t11e €ind that• f one ehe parties is still living his consent must first • be secured· does· that mean that- -Sebretary ance- Kissinger's accep- of release ··on each phone -conversation would have 1 0-be included as well -·A I can only quote you the statement I think it says -- This separate deed of gift -- that is the me that incorporates the telephone· convertiations· -- ·incorpor- ates the _· t rms of the original donation And then it says a couple $ente ces later The· sole di ft rence that ·lf one ·-of th parties· to th Ei · conversation is still living his conssrit ·must first be·- secured ii I do not f6r·-you is • ' I krt6w-whether I shou id interpret that I ·would--reacf it-·ahatuiit is an added condition Q you hlive given Ariothe2rquestion the deecf of ·gift that· us is dated 2 4 December and signed by Secretary Kissinger· and 5 becetnbet' s°igned by Mr Boorstin A-6 and you say i t is announced today 28-December and we had of course a whole go-around yesterday on·27 December Is this a case of predating or of the spokesman not being ' informed _ - tion - _ Bernie I am not able to answer that ques- A I - am going· to' have to stick with wliat I have ·given you Well it is a serious question in that is Q the dating accurate here ture or -He went Is 'bhat Kissinger's real signa- We know he is in Aca ulco since -- when to Acapulco Orf the· 25th· · · - sOri tlle · 251 li' · Q Yes Q So this was signed by him before he left _· ' I · _I - - '· Washington A I would asswne so If you would like me to check that I wi 11 be happy to Q The date 24th has been written in A We will have to look intooit I cannot answer you on that from here now Q rnio- wrote that in Is that the Secretary's handwriting Q Do you call that handwriting ff A-7 were you advised of any of this yesterd_' 1Y Q or is this something you looked into and were f_ven this after you looked into it A • I I I was personally not advised of this yesterday - ou just_ g ot t his_ today isn't that right Q John ·- · J _A Excuse 111e Joe • Q ' • _· ' • ' '- - · · ' j ' · - 7 Y_ou j1 1s got thi s _ The ex ange today or the press statement and e COPY of the letter ·- • - • '- • J 0 You were made aware of it only today V A I was instructed on it today correct r ' I'' _ ' DECLASSiFIED---- di utbority - --__ NJY19 1· ·j B 1 Q Where are a·ll these papers now physically at the White House·as ·well as the State Department · · _ A The· ones we are talking about now O· Yes · ·-·· A -· think- all ·but· the most recent notes · ·Joe have - already been delivered to the·- tibrary ' ' · _ - · _ A· ·· _ o - _ John I -am still ' con ' fused ·about why the Secretary dhanged his mind· · ··When he fira t· -- we had a legal memor_andum from the Lega·l Offiae _citing ·case law as well as · precedent -- ·_very firm ruling- that these -werE p1rtvate pap·ers ariit they remain private - -- -for ··the· ·Secmetary to deal with them ·· - _ _ · - c· · · •'' · - - - t ·_ · · • You sa id- h focused on the- privacy ·aspaat _ _- privacy· of what· l ---· just private ri ght' to them · - or- ·what t ·• privacy· ao ns ideratioris were ri'ghts of privaoyi·to 'Pt3rsons who·were party or may have been party to the telephone converm ion Q ·This says1- The· notea_ are1 ·being donated under sepa·rate deed1 of -gift because of the significant rights of privacy that may ex st Which simply says that the B 2 people that were first party to the phone conversations have a right in determing who gets to see them What made him change his mind A r _ ·· _ - - ---- I-think I said it was recognized there were rights of • pri-vacy which we e• no t raised by·· the other papers s ··He ha iv now had· time-- to· focus · on··t he issues that i rir re - cfrorn· -that · and has 1made' ·his-decision · r ' · l Q l One ·-ot her r 1egal ··aspect to· this c· ' - ·- Some··pE opta have· so u 111zv_ through· the Freedom of lftfomnat on A01t'- eo -gain lnfbt1na'l dbn' 'from ·these telephone conversations -- whether they were mentioned in them Can they now that-- they are beiftg•'d r nated ta 1 fremr these papers Or is it officially still being recogni zea ·· as p etrsonal·'' papers ' and not Gov imment pape s and- 1 •he·ie fore · ·no'tf ·sub1 t th· ' ·the Freeaoin of · · Inforina1tion c Aet · on th'at· wi-t hdmt looking into it your ques1 lon 'rathe-r·- _ r Right __ - i-•1 ·- @ I will have to take - _ -- ·' ' '- ' ' ' •• 11' _ DECLASSjFJj i rthority NNeD19Q B - -- · ratner - than venture an incorrect The original grant listed botli ·private Q and copies o·e officia-1 · pape·rs · and 1-t ·was· ·a -private · gra·nt o th•- Secretary of State The original documents •stiay 'in·· 1 ·h'e originatfn agett·cie'tr -- ·so these things are then in effect still private papers wnich he •is' donttf'i·ng to the Jibrciry of ecrtgress· - - -and thEf original -rubrics' o·f gaining knowledge a f these· things ·sti lil 1· remain 1 -·-·cover· everything -- right so ·they are · still pri•vate papers as far as that is ·•concerned ·-- he · has ·riot-· ch nged his• mind ·on· - · · that Again I am not a legal expert Ken A I would have to check into it and try··to get you ari answlUf I· don·' t What does·the phrase mean Q what __ - · A - Nevertheless r • Dick 1e·t ·m•J just stick with what the statement says · - 1 • · '• - o· Well what does he say A To avoid any misinterp etation during his final day in public office · ·But it would have to -- to misinterpret Q i t would have to misinterpret some thing · What is the '· ·I· am juat·_going to ·'sttay with what· I have A - giv en you got e·ither Larry -Eagleburger who · ·ts '·dealing ·with · this t · -•or ··whatev-er --- legal- peO ple -J - 4·to come down and 0 maybe who drafted ·this statementi ' c· · · · There are an awful lot of unanswered questions A I will look ·into thau· possibili_1 y Ken Q John what was the volume of the telephone yes notes ' ' · ·· · In terms of -A Quanttty Q· How many cases · or• many ··notes are there A I do not know 0 You· have no idea -•· ✓ · 'I hmi muah -- how • • l ---' •• ' - '•-' ·- ' --------- ------ -- B 5 i l Q But most·of them you say are now in the Library of ·congress · I · 11 btit j ·_· - ·o the most recent-ones Tbs 1· telephone conversations that he·· 'had · -'l l I · abroad -- he traveled widely -- and on ·the airplane and so on But those that were at Emaassies or at Foreign ·Missions abroad -- what happened to those notes Are they also part of the -- of this·giiit A Again ·Joe I would have to take the'· ques tion and try to get you an answer Q could we go to another subject then A Is there anything eise on this subject that I can or can't answer O K Joe Q Well as I said I suppose what ·1 say-about this and your responses to my questions will have to be put on the embargo until 2 00 o'clock1 because that is when this -A There i's rib e·mbargO Q Tuesday afternoon on that Oh he delivered it at 2 00 o'clock · B_ 6 Q· rt' s be'en broken - -- · t' · ·- Re·feri ihg to Clark -Clifford's fir t p'l l lic discussion iii ·twerity' eight years of what the i formation copy here says is the struggle between the State Department and the White House over recognition of _Isra l • an4 on page 10 of -this· -- of the te-xt o f the address that was given to ·the'media · it says that the· evidence includes documents that are not found in the recently published volume of Foreign Relations whiah the Stat epartment put out ·tor use on November 20th last Could the Department look into this and_ see whether or not · the documents would be construe as evidence of the -- what Clifford says was sabotage of Prssidential policy Is there-published by the Department in some form as an addenda to the record in the Foreign Relations volume -- that's a -- A Once we c n see -tjla t t Joe and see exactly what Mr C liffo Jrd is going to e _saying -- I think we could probably try _to chec that for you yes Q O K B - 7 Q the The charge is made by Mr Clifford that ·chief of · the eJ ements· in the State Department who he -said sought to destroy these Presidential · po·licy a partition of i'alestine '' '°'- was Loy· Henderson · If it runs true this about Henderson's activities and yet the · state Department the -Secretary· of State • ·dip Mr Henderson the honor··of naming a hall in the State Department after him as -a- model of Foreign Service duty 1 to· the Government and-· cthe ' peopTe of the United· -States • Is it the State- Depar1 ment's view'··and i·s· it the --S$Cr t ry · of State '·s · view that· acti'on ·of this kind by a -Chie f of a Bureau -- that apparently -- from Clifford's remarks ana from·the State Department's own report -documentation -- indicates-that Henderson sought in every possible way as· £ar as wca could see to· block - in Clifford's own words -- block the policy of the President on partition Will the Secretary have second thoughts on this A Joe you are trying to make a connection between an allegation contained in what Mr Clifford ie going to be saying publicly in more than an hour from now -- and the recognition of Mr Henderson's services to the Country and the Department over a long period of time _ __ _ _ 1 DEcLASSIF _ putnorlty NN D19s Si1 __ _ 1 11111----------- - - - - - 7- · • - _· •__ _· • ••• -• - - ·· _•• _ _ _·_ _ · ·- -- - -7 - -- -7· ·- ·- · _· _- _ 1 i· ' ' -- r c • _ '· · - '•• ' •• · - · ' - - - _·_ · · •· • - • ' - - · C containe· - J ·r ' vol l ru ··that you -- in · _1t ' a ·· b$ i · · · ·_ · in this · · - --· ·- ·' ' - · - · ·- 1• - _ ·· · omitted- from· • - ' _I · _ 0' It - - · ·· - ' -- _ · _·· Thank y m- - John · ' - Pt'oceedin -ended ·at 1_2 55 p· m I 4•• • - · - - · -- ·i · I ·- ' • ' _ _ - r ' - • -- •• SECOND DEED OF GIFT AND AGREEMENT Henry A Kissinger hereby donates to the United States of America to be held and administered by the Library of Congress and its officials as part of a collection of the papers of Henry A Kissing r additional personal papers consisting of the transcribed secretarial notes of his telephone conversations In implementing this gift and as conditions to its donation Henry A Kissinger and the Library of Congress agree to the following 1 The terms and conditions of the Deed of Gift and Agreement executed on November 12 1976 by Henry A Kissinger and the Librarian of Congress First Deed of Gift are hereby incorporated by reference and extended to the present gift except as provided in paragraph 2 below 2 At the end of the period of time described in · paragraph 4 of the First Deed of Gift a paper shall be available for public access in the following manner A committee of three consisting of the Secretary of State or his designee and two other persons named by the President of the United States shall decide whether public access to the particular paper is consistent with the foreign policy interests of the United States and whether such access is consistent with the rights of privacy or the protection of the reputations of persons still living If the committee concludes that both criteria are satisfied the paper shall be made available for public access The committee shall consult with a·representative of the Estate of Henry A Kissinger with respect to rights of privacy of persons still living Witnessed and agreed to this_·_ day of December 1976 Heriry A Kissinger Accepted and agreed to on behalf of the Library of Congress this day of December 1976 Daniel J Boorstin Librarian of Congress - - - o eyEC FOR THE SECRETARY The attached is a format for signature in case you decide ·to adopt the last alternative which we discussed on the telephoni · ct Mr Leigh Mr Aherne I I I SECOND DEED OF GIFT AND AGREEMENT Henry A Kissinger hereby donates to the United States of America to be held and administered by the Library of Congres and its officials as part of a collection of papers of Henry A Kissinger ·additional personal papers consisting of the transcribed secretarial notes of his telephone conversations In implementing this gift and as conditions -to its donation Henry A Kissinger and the Library of Congress agree to the following 1 The terms and conditions of the Deed of Gift and Agreement executed on November 12 19 76 by Henry A Kissinger and the Librarian of Congress First Deed of Gift are hereby incorporated by reference and extended o the present gift except as provided in paragraph 2 below 2 At the end of the period of time described in paragraph 4 of the First Deed of Gift any paper included in this Second Deed of Gift shall become available for public access unless one of the parties to the telephone conversation is still living in which case such a paper shall become available for public access only with his consent or upon his death · Witnessed and agreed to this day of December 1976 Henry A Kissinger Accepted and agreed to on behalf of the Library of Congress this day of December 1976 Daniel J Boorstin Librarian of Congress ✓ I am today placing all the records and materials listed below the Materials in the custody of the Library of Congress the Library under the following agreement I 1 The Library will be responsible for the pres- ervation and protection of the Materials I and agents designated by me shall have access to the Materials and shall have the right to obtain photographic reproductions of any documentary materials 2 The Library will retain custody of the Mater- ials until December 31 1980 -If during that time any legal proceeding commenced in a United States Court con cerning the custody ownership or disposition of the Materials whether or not I am a party to such proceeding and whether such proceeding is a separate action or a part of the litigation concerning tne Presidential - 2 historical materials of the Nixon Administration the I ·-Materials will be retained by the Library until all such proceedings are finally determined and the Materials shall throughout such period be subject to the order of If no judicial proceeding concerning the the courts custody ownership or disposition of the Materials commences on or before December 31 1980 the Library shall o n my request return 'the Materials to me 3 The Library will not allow any other party to have access to the Materials without my consent except in accordance with the order of a court of competent jurisdiction • The Library will at all times control access -· to the area in which the Materials are stored and work areas in which they may be located during access as provided below A record will be kept of all persons having ao ess to the Materials including the time each such access begins and ends and the name of the individual having access Stringent safeguards will be maintained by the Library to insure that no portion of the Materials is I i nJured or removed - 3 Such safeguards shall include as a -minimum binding of all transcripts and documents in · large volumes and thorough inspection of all materials documents and carrying cases carried by any person having access to the Materials at the end of each such access - 3 - _ injured or removed Such safeguards shall include as a -minimum binding of all transcripts and documents in · large volumes and thorough inspection of all materials documents and carrying cases carried by any person hav- ing access to the Materials at the end of each such access -- I SECOND DEED OF GIFT AND AGREEMENT Henry A Kissinger hereby donates to the United States of America to be held and administered by the Library of Congress and its officials as part of a collection of the papers of Henry A Kissinger additional personal papers consisting of the transcribed secretarial notes of his telephone conversations In implementing this gift and as conditions to its donation Henry A Kissinger and the Library of Congress agree to the following 1 The terms and conditions of the Deed of Gift and Agreement executed on November 12 1976 by Henry A Kissinger and the Librarian of Congress First Deed of Gift are hereby incorporated by reference and extended to the present gift except as provided in paragraph 2 below 2 At the end of the period of time described in paragraph 4 of the First Deed of Gift a paper shall be available for public access only if such access is approved by a committee comprised of the then Secretary of State or his designate the Archivist of the United States or his designate and a representative of the estate of Henry A Kissinger In deciding questions of access the committee shall consider the effect public access would have on the conduct of foreign policy and on the privacy and reputations of persons still living If the substance of a particular transcript is wholly personal that transcript shall be withheld from public access Witnessed and agreed to this _ _ day of December 1976 Henry A Kissinger Accepted and agreed to on behalf of the Library of Congress this day of December 1976 Daniel J Boorstin Librarian of congress