ЦК Ю1СС ✓ � Во время пребывания в США Бразилии и проездом в Мексике я имел несколько встреч с президентом США Джоном Кеннеди его· братом Робертом Кеннеди и некоторыми другими лицами из окруже­ ния президента в Бразилии - с преэидентом·Гулартом премьер­ министром Невесом министром иностранных дел Дантесом и некото­ рыми другими официальными лицами в Мексике - краткую беседу с президентом Лопесом Матеосом Из этих стран были направлены в Москву телеграммы в которых сообщалось о характере бесед ХотЕ лось 6ы доложить Центральному Комитету о некоторых деталях и о6с_тоятельст вах при которых происходили встречи и беседы в С ША с тем чтобы несколько дополнить картину Пер вое что сразу было отмечено и американскими журналисте ми и журналистами других западных стран аккредитованншли в Вашингтоне это повышенный интерес американской общественности к самому факту как выразился Липпман участившихся контактов м ежду США и СССР на _разных уро вшп - В ту пору когда я был в Соединенных Штатах это связывалось с тем что М Харламов � встретился в Париже с П Селенджеро м газеты много шумели о возмож�ости поездки Р Кеннеди в СССР и наконец комментирова­ лось пригла шение президентом меня на завтрак Было много домыс­ лов на эт от счет и прямых вопросов во время приема в посольст �·в е на котором присутствовали видные американские журналисты _ Липпман Чайлде Рестон Хиггинс директора телевизионных и радиокомпаний и т д Как можно было понять иэ разговоров с этими журналистами из сообщений печати в Соединенных Штатах - 4 � Л Ц� А j _�-��A S Adzhubei's Account ofHis Visit to Washington to the СС CPSU 12 March 1962 TOP SECRET During rny visit to Washington Brazil and passing through Mexico I had а few rneetings with US President John Kennedy his brother Robert Keimedy and а few other figures frorn the President's circle In Brazil I rnet with President Goulart Prirne Minister Neves Minister oflntemational Affairs Dantos and а few other officials In Mexico I had а short conversation with President Lopez Mateos Telegrarns were dispatched to Moscow frorn these countries in which the character of these conversations was reported I would like to report to the Central Cornrnittee а few rnore details and circurnstances about the rneetings and conversations which occurred in the USA which will help to cornplete the picture Firstly what surprised Arnericanjoumalists and joumalists of other Westem nations accredited to Washington was the heightened interest of Arnerican society in the very fact as Walter Lipprnann expressed it of the contact between the USA and the USSR on various levels When I was in the United States this concemed М Кharlarnov's rneeting with Р Salinger The newspapers rnade а lot ofnoise about the possibility of R Kennedy rnaking а trip to the USSR Finally there was talk of the president's inviting те to breakfast There were а nurnber of conjectures on this account and rnany direct questions at the tirne of the reception at the ernbassy at which rnany notaЫe Arnerican joumalists were present Lipprnan Childs Reston Higgins directors of television and radio cornpanies etc It was possiЫe to understand frorn the conversations with these joumalists frorn the announcernents of the services that in the United States there is now а heightened nervousness and extraordinary interest in taking any step which could occur in one way or another that frorn the point of view of Arnericans prornotes the possiЬility of reconciling Arnerican-Soviet differences Much has happened to те in Arnerica but I have never seen such agitated anticipation for the irnprovernent of relations between our countries as exists now · Nikita Sergeevich Кhrushchev said that the hour has соте - the Arnerican nation is beginning to wake up and Arnericans are ceasing to Ье lazy seals that warrn thernselves on warrn shores It is clear that the tirne is approaching In any case as the rnost experienced Arnericanjoumalists say frankly in rnany respects they can't figure Arnericans out Thus Childs has said about the persecution of the Cornrnunist party in the USA If it was not for this occurring it is possiЫe that in the past thousands of Arnericans especially the youth would not have dernonstrated а large interest towards Marxisrn and your ideas Even now when I visit universities because I arn farniliar with Russia in а way they don't ask rne about rny travels in other countries but what I think about Cornrnunisrn When I told Lipprnan that there is а very positive atrnosphere at the Soviet ernbassy he laughed and rejoined And how You've signed the German peace treaty established a border in Berlin put a gate there and since you signed the agreement a war hasn't started and now everything is settling normally I gave the appearance that I did not understand Lippman and said to him The agreement is still not signed You are clearly getting ahead of events ''No it is you who have gotten ahead of events Lippman remarked you understand everything wonderfully and most importantly your premier understands this At this very moment a few other American journalists approached us including Childs and Reston Hearing what was being said one of them remarked I am sure that you will not sign the German peace treaty for a long time yet Why I asked Because it is very convenient to have a callus on your neighbor's foot who you don't particularly like There is always the possibility in such cases of unintentionally disturbing this callus and doing your neighbor harm but then you can excuse yourself and say that it was an accident At the time of the conversation about Germany and the problem of West Berlin it was perceived that the Americanjournalists lacked the level of interest they had only a few months ago Violating all norms of protocol a few dozen American journalists and Kennedy advisers stayed at the Soviet embassy until almost midnight lfl were to summarize the conversation that occurred that night it would go something like this Eisenhower became president of the USA at first because in the eyes of the American people he was considered to be a hero of the Second World War But the second time in this very capacity Eisenhower came forward like a peacemaker in the Korean War His announcement that if elected he would succeed in achieving a Korean peace practically won him the presidency Kennedy did not have many of Eisenhower's advantages with regard to popularity Kennedy's administration and the journalists and newspapers which supported Kennedy including a number of prominent newspapers like the New York Times tried to do his political business for him The newspapers were full of various articles telling the story of the ascent of John Kennedy They talked about his service in the navy during the war and there were big advertisements on the occasion of his various appearances and speeches there was also the story about the Kennedy family as being the ideal American family One of the journalists even said to me as a joke We know that the Soviet Union struggles with the cult of personality It is clear that we have begun our own cult of Kennedy and it may be that at some point we will have to struggle with this cult It goes without saying that Kennedy was often worried and was preoccupied with the idea that it would be difficult for him to win the votes needed for a second term Kennedy had already announced his candidacy and his administration was ready to actively cultivate public opinion of that there could be no doubt However Kennedy himself his brother and those people closest to him until that time were extremely alarmed that Kennedy had not won the election with a very large advantage over the Republicans Now they are making every effort to start a new election campaign and gain a firmer position from which to go to the polls against the Republicans more boldly This circumstance is forcing Kennedy and his closest people to take various measures in connection with all of the following methods I've already spoken about one of thesethe Cult of Kennedy A second is to present the affair in this manner - that Kennedy has gathered around himself the most intelligent Americans and that he organized a dynamic administration Not without obvious pleasure journalists announced that Kennedy himself and those closest to him openly mocked Eisenhower who was now openly called the Golf President In connection with this Reston told me a joke which as he expressed it he tried not to tell to foreigners during the reign of Eisenhower When Ike planned to go to meet you the Soviet Union there were rumors in America that Mister Khrushchev prepared a field to play golf somewhere in Moscow In that connection we said When Ike plays golf in the USA that is only half the trouble When he wins or loses in America it concerns only us Americans in the end Premier Khrushchev will surely lose to Eisenhower at golf in the Soviet Union and along with this victory the old man will lose to Khrushchev in completely different terms This was one extremely important thing for Kennedy and any other future American president The President of the United States must be able to speak so they say with Soviet leaders In the end this advantage seemed to be the most important With good reason so they say during agitation at meetings many voices really rallied around Kennedy saying Nixon cannot talk with Premier Khrushchev and ifhe can it is only in the kitchen in that way the conversation between Nixon and N S Khrushchev in the kitchen of a typical American household during the American exhibition in Moscow was ironically ridiculed Kennedy knows how to speak with Premier Khrushchev The Kennedy administration has persistently influenced the American people in the manner described above Kennedy himself and his circle however are worried that he will not be able to prove to Americans in time his ability to make agreements and reconcile the continuous questions about the Soviet Union When Childs and I said goodbye to one another Childs and I have been acquainted for a long time We participated together in the New Year's discussion in 1959 in Paris he frankly said We came to the Soviet embassy today and spent so much time here because we supposed that Kennedy had obviously decided to show that he is seriously beginning a serious dialogue with Khrushchev I answered that I could not vouch for Kennedy but that as concerns the Soviet government it is always prepared for serious conversations regarding the resolution of differences Childs added As you know I sympathize with the Democrats and am worried about Kennedy He maintains approximately 125 000 reservists in the army This is 125 000 votes against him plus their wives fiancees mothers and fathers - that is around half a million votes fu November 1962 he accumulated votes in the House of Representatives and in the third place in the Senate Although in the United States the president can do without a majority in either the Senate or the House it is better to nevertheless have this majority fu this fashion the November 1962 elections continued Childs will be a kind ofrehearsal before his re-election campaign which Kennedy will begin sometime in 1963 The day after my trip to Washington the president had me over for breakfast at which his wife her sister and Bolshakov and his wife were in attendance This detail drew my attention When I exchanged greetings with Kennedy he almost immediately directed the conversation towards Cuba and how I liked it there Receiving a suitable answer he paused a little and said How is Che Guevara I answered that he didn't seem to look bad although I didn't see him often and asked him in turn why was the president suddenly interested in one of the participants of the Cuban revolution I read some dispatches to the press answered Kennedy fu turn I remarked You are interested in the events in Cuba that is your right But when we read that the USA plans to invade Cuba we don't think that this is your right We are not planning an invasion of Cuba Kennedy answered I reminded him And what of the mercenaries from Guantanamo and those other countries You already changed your opinion regarding the landing in April 1961 that it was a mistake for America Kennedy hit his fist on the table and said Once I summoned Allen Dulles and rebuked him I said to him 'learn from the Russians When they had a tough situation in Hungary they put an end to the conflict in just three days When they didn't like the events in Finland the president of that country went to meet with the Soviet premier in Siberia and everything was worked out And you Dulles couldn't do a thing ' I answered the President With regard to Hungary your analogy with Cuba is entirely untenable With regard to Finland well maybe this is the case which should make the United States aware that they need to learn to respect Cuba After all we respect Finland Even though Capitalist elements exist within it the president of a bourgeois government retains good relations with the Soviet Union Kennedy became quiet and then with earnestness said From a psychological point of view it is very hard for the American people to agree with what is going on in Cuba After all it is only 90 miles from our coast It is very hard he repeated and then added Cuba fell from within It is necessary to become reconciled with a great many things I remarked to the President And there are a great many things to become accustomed to and it is clear that there are a great number of new things that the American people must get used to Only do not meddle in events in Cuba this is most important But your people understand this Kennedy remarked sharply We will not meddle with events in Cuba It's a very big shame Mister President I said to him that your words are not allowed to be published in the newspapers Kennedy asked the question How would Castro react to the fact that you were invited to Washington from Havana I said that Castro was very happy about this he has an appreciation for peaceful coexistence which would include an improvement in U S relations We can talk more about this after breakfast if you permit it Then as I have already written Kennedy sent Salinger and Akolovsky away and asked Bolshakov to be the interpreter The conversation continued for almost two hours The content of the conversation has already been announced from Washington In the course of the conversation Kennedy said that he was going to a press conference the following day one which was usually held at the State Department At the press conference there were more than 400 journalists present There was a heightened sense of interest towards it Although this conference occurred immediately after the completion of the conference in Punta-del-Este Kennedy was however literally tongue-tied and uttered only a few words about the inter-American conference He was not asked one question in connection with this conference In the corridors American journalists asked What is there to ask the president when the United States has failed Brazil Mexico and other nations gave us a slap in the face There was one question asked which frustrated Kennedy One of the journalists asked In connection with the conclusion of the conference at Punta-del-Este did the United States return to normal trade relations with Cuba or will it still not be possible to buy cigars there fu a malcontented tone Kennedy responded I am not involved in the proceedings of that event It seems that there is some talk about the sale of some medical supplies Maybe we will receive cigars in return And that prompted an explosion of laughter in the hall A few questions about Soviet-American relations were asked which included one question about whether Kennedy is planning to visit the Soviet Union and whether or not he has some kind of invitation to do so Kennedy was troubled by this question and was feeling particularly clumsy because of the presence of Soviet journalists His answer was evasive meaning approximately that he would like to visit the Soviet Union but he was not invited At that time the theme of Kennedy traveling to the Soviet Union and meeting with N S Khrushchev appeared continuously in American newspapers Americans with whom I have the opportunity to speak ask this question if they are in some way interested in political questions I would also like to point out one more fact in connection with Kennedy's press conference He was asked many empty overtly demagogic questions on third-rate problems This created the impression that this waste of time is a very American tradition created by the imperial propaganda machine for the befuddlement of the people After the press conference Kennedy asked about one more meeting which as he expressed it will be of a strictly confidential character This has already been reported to Moscow Mind you the president has a fear of being simple and open before Soviet journalists Through Bolshakov Salinger agreed that at 6 00 that evening he would send a car for me from the White House in which I would ride around the city so that journalists would not discover the president's new meeting with a Soviet editor And sure enough the car carried us down some long streets and at last we arrived at the White House at the president's private entrance The gate opened quickly we were asked for no documents and the car went immediately through the entrance Kennedy was waiting and walking around the corridor He immediately came into the room and in a nervous tone began the conversation Gesticulating he said Your armies are in Europe I know the strength and potential of your military machine Khrushchev can of course - and Kennedy made a gesture with his hands - can take West Berlin But then this would possibly provoke a rupture of relations between the Western nations and your nation and lead to tension I want to emphasize to you again with all seriousness that it is my plan to find some mutually beneficial solution to this problem which does not encroach on the positions that you cannot give up as well as those positions from which we cannot retreat I ask you to report and if possible to do it only orally that the U S England and France are opposed to German reunification Such a dynamic and powerful state would be a cause of concern for us We realize that unification is unrealistic however publicly I must speak about unification And because of this there could be no talk about recognizing the GDR and neither the border on the Elbe i e the border between the two Germanys With respect to other border questions it is completely possible that steps intended to regulate our disputes will lead to an announcement of the recognition of borders on the Oder and Neisse Kennedy very insistently as in the first conversation harped on the idea that in the next several years it will be necessary to work out some mutually-agreeable relations that will lead to some softening of the general world situation and permit as he expressed it a more composed perspective from which to observe the state of affairs in the world In connection with this he said that in Laos he will tie Boun Oum' s arms if for our part we guarantee him the Pathet Lao's equanimity Kennedy is clearly worried about the situation in Southeast Asia and particularly of course in South Vietnam He did not answer any questions about South Vietnam and the position of the United States in South Korea and did not want to continue the conversation on this theme uttering the general phrase that neither the USSR nor the USA had any major interests in that region and we have to keep this in mind before all other things He once again repeated the idea previously addressed that the United States of America and the Soviet Union send many weapons there but these weapons and these complications can be used by a third power more interested in a conflict between the USA and the USSR Then Kennedy long-windedly talked about how he emphasized with utmost urgency the Berlin problem Continuing the previous conversation he said that he would like a more constructive and as he stated it more precisely a more personal dialogue between Minister Gromyko and Ambassador Thompson insofar as they now only exchange general declarations We would like Kennedy said for them to sit at a table have in their hands the map of Germany and begin to look for possibilities for a settlement which would be equally agreeable to the Soviet Union and the United States of America I want your government to understand it is impossible for us to leave West Berlin or to permit a Soviet military presence there In connection with my question Why can't the question of a guarantee come from the United Nations or the neutral nations he said that this is also not possible that it would lead to the total collapse of the Western Bloc You understand he began to say in a concerned way the more complex our relations become in Berlin and Germany the more insistent Adenauer becomes For the time being I am restraining him and have sufficient arguments for not giving him atomic weapons However these high-level complications that are arising between us are prompting retaliatory forces in West Berlin Kennedy was obviously calculating that this phrase on some level would if not frighten us per se intimidate us Kennedy answered It is not that we are afraid of West Germany and the president understands this perfectly Maybe this is a delicate question - I asked Kennedy whether the United States was afraid of West Germany or still more whether England and France were afraid of West Germany It is possible to be afraid of the Germans Kennedy answered Then he said I understand that you and your allies can't use the words 'occupation force' But with regard to a small contingent of soldiers it would be possible to find a different name Now about the access Kennedy continued I see things realistically Insofar as you object to international control of the highway it is senseless for us to insist on it After all the officers of the GDR are already I thanked the president for pronouncing the full name-the German Democratic Republic-before me for the first time putting their stamps in documents The important thing is not who will be affixing the stamps Could you and I fantasize a bit this is exactly what he said about some compromise steps regarding western powers access to West Berlin We are ready to meet the Soviet Union halfway and we will not have political ties with the FRG Maybe you too could meet us halfway in terms of some softening on the western positions in the issue of access Then the president developed this idea the situation could arise that the Soviet fleet was carried by storm into the waters of Franco's Spain In such a case you would not be able to make contact with Franco but would you not ask that a third power somehow intercede on your behalf We already tried to do this when the question arose about the Soviet tanker Tuapse which was seized in a bandit fashion by your friend Cian Kai Shek and nothing came of out it Let's not talk about the past the president said We also have friends we don't like So if an American caravan of freight cars gets into a conflict on a highway we cannot--and don't not try forcing us to do it--begin a dialogue with Ulbricht It would clearly mean being pulled into recognizing the GDR To whom would we tum in such a case to deescalate to untie this crisis I answered that ifit was defined by this simple analogy it was obvious that the U S would tum to some sort of third power Kennedy said Now maybe it will be worthwhile to fantasize around this Once again he emphasized We understand we cannot win international control and of course it is foolish to cling to that which will not be put in writing Then Kennedy spoke about how they worked out with Macmillan a new pretext for disarmament which he considers would meet with a constructive response from the Soviet government side One can imagine how stunned Kennedy was when he heard about our plan to convene the Committee of 18 states on disarmament at the highest level This undoubtedly struck out Kennedy and Macmillan's hopes to have an initiative Then Kennedy said that he personally welcomes the contact which existed between Bolshakov and Robert Kennedy insofar as it gives him the possibility to manage without the services of a translator from the State Department These observations show that surely in the presence of Akolovsky and even Salinger - a person closer to him the president speaks with a completely different tongue and is visibly more tense He asked Was your conversation with Robert Kennedy after breakfast interesting I answered that his brother was quiet and said almost nothing about international problems Then I for some reason inadvertently asked the president I recently saw in Life magazine a big portrait of your brother Robert Kennedy below which was a passage The number 2 man The hard-line unrelenting younger brother Is this accurate that Robert Kennedy has become the #2 man in the USA Kennedy was surprised Even you turned your attention to this I spoke with my brother on this subject and said to him that if he is planning to become No 1 this would not be so easy for him and that he would sooner become No 3 No 4 No 5 No 6 By the way --remarked Kennedy-- there was quite a scandal with regard to my brother's trip to the Soviet Union We are now trying to find the person in the State Department who make it public that Robert might visit the Soviet Union as a private citizen I very much wanted him to meet with Chairman Khrushchev But when the American press created a scandal we were forced to deny it Clearly here we need to arrange all these things more simply remarked Kennedy Look here you invited Salinger to Moscow and the Republicans are already attacking Salinger and me Saying goodbye after the conversation he asked me to give his greetings to N S Khrushchev in the hopes as he said smiling of the possibility of a calmer meeting than in Vienna where I was more concerned about how to behave in front of a whole pack of journalists Then Kennedy asked me how I spent my day in Washington I answered that Washington is always boring because there is nowhere to go here there are no theaters no good concert hall But tomorrow you will have a violin concert-noted I-it will be quite interesting to attend Yes Kennedy confirmed Washington is certainly a capital without theaters As you know we plan to build a large cultural center in Washington but this would require nearly 30 million dollars Right now my wife and I are occupied with writing letters to various parties to give donations for the construction But it is going very slowly People don't want to part with the money But why wouldn't you Mr President I asked Kennedy give the money from your own private means After all your family is very rich and if you made such a grand gesture you would probably obtain a good many kind words for your own household Kennedy smiled and said completely frankly Yes but here we are talking about rµy own money The next morning when I was intending to leave for New York to board my flight for Mexico Harriman unexpectedly called me and said that he was prepared to go to the Soviet Embassy to see me for a few minutes or if it was more convenient asked me to see him I answered that it would be better ifl dropped in on Mr Harriman The conversation with Harriman took 15 or 20 minutes and was of a general character Harriman was concerned with Laos and reiterated Kennedy's idea a few times that it would be good to agree about Laos Then he asked me to send Khrushchev a big hello and said that he remembered the meeting with Nikita Sergeevich and was happy to welcome him at his home All our family remembers this visit and remembers that the Chairman carried the conversation lightly and nonchalantly Harriman said I am an old man but I dream about a new meeting with Khrushchev and am sure we will certainly speak about U S Soviet relations Harriman asked permission for several journalists and photographers to come into his office and repeat his greeting for N S Khrushchev and to say again in the presence of the press that he would like to meet with N S Khrushchev to discuss many important problems This was all obviously done with the consideration that Harriman's name would once again appear in print especially in connection with the fact that he is acquainted with and has spoken to N S Khrushchev A Adzhubei Source Archive of the President of the Russian Federation Special declassification April 2002 Translated by Adam Mayle for the National Security Archive